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The big funding debate

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  • #16
    Maybe Morgan could try the TJ again?

    Comment


    • LoveSprints1
      LoveSprints1 commented
      Editing a comment
      That would be interesting. Last year on the Backstraight Boys and Girl podcast she spoke about a possible return to Multi events. Indoors would be a good starting point, but she was never a swift sprinter. I hope she gives a pentathlon a go.

    • jjimbojames
      jjimbojames commented
      Editing a comment
      She always said she wanted to do one more, but that was when the HJ looked to be going somewhere. Might be more open to other options but I suspect she thinks she’s a world-class finalist again, so why change…

  • #17
    So, reading through the rulebook it is, unsurprisingly, full of contradictions and loopholes. Like, it says in part that if you've received podium support in the past you shouldn't be considered for Podium Potential. I think that's utterly daft - someone can have a barren few years where their performance does not justify support but then can turn that around in the right environment.

    Also, the doesn't take into account things like NCAA, pregnancy and what safeguards are there re funding or other things that can impact. This is just what I would do if I were in charge, trying to fulfill the central goal given of a medal at either Paris or LA.


    My own criteria added - I want us to be challenging for a medal in all relays, so I want some support there for the M 4x400m, even if the times don't deserve it. There are some athletes with potential who could be added to this list next year but I would prefer to see progression before I do. Equally there are some athletes who are unlucky that they compete in events where we have depth - people like Melissa Courtney-Bryant who is a perfectly good runner but we already would be funding 5 people whose 1500m PB is better.

    Olympic Podium (16)
    Zharnel Hughes
    Adam Gemili
    Reece Prescod - IF he agrees to a closely monitored plan, developed with him - his own words are that he wasn't focused etc. That can't continue if he wants to be funded.

    Dina Asher-Smith
    Daryll Neita
    Jodie Williams

    Josh Kerr
    Jake Wightman
    Laura Muir

    Keely Hodgkinson
    Jemma Reekie

    Eilish McColgan
    Callum Hawkins

    Holly Bradshaw

    Nick Miller

    Katarina Johnson-Thompson

    Olympic Podium Potential (31)
    Elliot Giles

    Daniel Rowden
    Oliver Dustin

    Max Burgin
    Jamie Webb
    Jake Heyward
    Charlie Da’Vall Grice
    Alex Bell
    Sarah McDonald

    Andrew Pozzi

    Lizzie Bird
    Aimee Pratt
    Laura Weightman

    Marc Scott
    Andrew Butchart
    Tom Bosworth
    Callum Wilkinson

    Harry Coppell
    Morgan Lake
    Emily Borthwick
    Lorraine Ugen
    Abigail Irozuru
    Jazmin Sawyers
    Naomi Ogbeta
    Tom Gale


    Scott Lincoln
    Sophie McKinna

    Taylor Campbell

    Tim Duckworth
    Niamh Emerson

    Holly Mills

    Olympic Relays (21)
    Asha Philip
    Imani-Lara Lansiquot
    Beth Dobbin

    Kristal Awuah
    Desiree Henry

    CJ Ujah
    Richard Kilty
    Nethaneel Mitchell-Blake


    Laviai Nielsen
    Hannah Williams
    Nicole Yeargin
    Zoey Clark
    Emily Diamond

    Jessie Knight

    Ama Pipi

    Cameron Chalmers
    Matthew Hudson-Smith - same as Prescod - there is clear talent there, not being tapped properly.
    Ed Faulds
    Joe Brier
    Charlie Dobson

    Chris McAlister

    Comment


    • Loop-guru
      Loop-guru commented
      Editing a comment
      This is a pretty good stab at what might happen in October when the next two years of athletes are chosen. From experience older athletes, those 30 and above who are not medalling could be in trouble. Also as they are looking towards 2024 expect to see our u23's and possibly u20's featuring. Tade Ojoro looks to have a chance at 110HH. Romell Glave if eligible looks a prospect with his windy 9.97 and Jeremiah Azu 10.19 (euro u23 gold). I would expect 10-15 u23's / u20's to feature as they are the most likely to improve the most with the right support. One slight nitpick with your selection is Chris McAlister who would not add anything to a 4x400 and there are currently 31 athletes better than him based on his pb (not seasons best which is even slower).

    • jjimbojames
      jjimbojames commented
      Editing a comment
      The youngsters normally go on Futures funding, and Faulds has one more year as an U20, I think.

      Chris is not Jessie - his flat speed (whilst likely quicker than his PB suggests) is not as good as his strength, but it’s improving. I think a few too many on the W4x400 list and maybe Dobbin either switches events or comes off, when you think the likes of Hunt, Awuah, Henry at full health will all be ahead of her, unless she does a Kilty and owns the bend.

      Yes to funding them for relay camps, but 9 W400m runners being funded individually is a lot

    • marra
      marra commented
      Editing a comment
      I tried to stick clear of the youngsters for the time being. I made an exception for Faulds because I want us to be seriously targetting the 4x400m from next year onwards and, frankly, he's already in our top 5 for that relay on time. No harm getting them prepped.

      With both Chris and Jessie I used a bit of 'creative accounting' - they are on the relay funding to be there if needed but really I wanted to support them in their individual event primarily. I just couldn't really justify it on performance alone right now.

      As for the numbers on the relay lists - I've actually reduced it slightly from where it is now. So I doubt it will be much different. There's a few names on the podium potential list (Butchart, Webb, Ugen etc) that you could make an argument for and against for sure.

  • #18
    re Reece Prescod: It may be that the current set up will indeed work out for him (although it didn't stop him false starting, what, three times in Tokyo? - yes, I know, early days, but...) But I don't think it's unreasonable that it should be at least looked at closely.
    Last edited by Occasional Hope; 11-08-21, 00:42.

    Comment


    • #19
      I agree Occasional Hope. @ Paps, I am not suggesting Prescod physically move again, or that Christian Malcolm, micro manage his daily coaching, but I do think having a greater input in terms of mentoring, given that he too was a sprinter of great talent (probably the most easy-on-the-eye, 'floating' type I ever witnessed), rather than a cool detached, variation on a jobsworth. Prescod and MHS, are gfited individuals, they both seem to be failing by whats going on in their head and not by any lack of physiology, Malcolm should be saying that both these can not fail on my watch, and no stone will be left unturned, otherwise we have squandered yet more talent. (ps, I would also have Reece return to 200s, and 100s only a supportive secondary aim) ...

      As I write this I also wonder what is the situation with Ojie Edoburun, another talented sprinter that we can not afford to caste aside...
      Last edited by carterhatch; 11-08-21, 07:59.

      Comment


      • carterhatch
        carterhatch commented
        Editing a comment
        That is welcome news about Ojie, SprintRelayFan, I remember reading a blog post he had written and being very impressed as well as quite prescient.
        [search Ojie Edoburun 'The Transition'] - oh and I note he has never run a competitve 400, just saying!

      • SprintRelayFan
        SprintRelayFan commented
        Editing a comment
        He's always struck me as a very mature/focused young man - I think the wind was only 2.4 or something as well. Off to read the blog now

      • LoveSprints1
        LoveSprints1 commented
        Editing a comment
        Thanks carterhatch it's a really interesting blog by Ojie. Full link is: https://medium.com/@ojieedoburun/tra...n-8813011ea68f

    • #20
      Originally posted by carterhatch View Post
      Prescod and MHS, are gfited individuals, they both seem to be failing by whats going on in their head
      Every bit as important as the body. But that can be turned around too, and some people need to go through set backs and maybe recalibrate before they fully blossom.

      I hope Prescod has really learned from this year as he does have serious talent. Agree that 200 looks like it ought to be his event.

      Comment


      • #21
        forgive the slight tangent (no, not the 'R' word)

        but speaking of Ojie Edoburun, and looking at his power of ten - it struck me how he has only ever recorded stats in the sprints 60/100/200, with one outlier a LJ in 2011. For heavens sake, is this a shining example of specialising at too young an age !! He is quite a 'unit' to use the vernacular, (wiki says 1.9m) and I venture if he were a female athlete, he would have competed in a number of different events in his informative years. (Blimey I was a borough sprint U15 champion but didnt stop my PE teacher making me run cross country for the school [pretty much last] or throw javelin [poorly]) and yet he has never, never. run a competitive 400, according to Po10, or tried the jumps beyond one effort ...

        we need to make best use of our limited talent pool, and it may well be sprints are his best event, but not being encourgad to try others is short sighted
        Last edited by carterhatch; 11-08-21, 13:06.

        Comment


        • #22
          Not directly to do with the funding debate, but has Ashleigh Nelson, a 3 x Olympian (London, Rio and Tokyo) actually ever run at the Olympics? She is now 30 so this would have been her last chance to compete.
          Last edited by LoveSprints1; 11-08-21, 15:03.

          Comment


          • SprintRelayFan
            SprintRelayFan commented
            Editing a comment
            No - she actually went to Beijing and Rio but wasn't selected for the teams that ran at either of them. Then she was injured in 2012 after having won the 100m trials!

          • Ursus
            Ursus commented
            Editing a comment
            Stew-Coach. Very tough on Ashleigh but she can’t be counted as an Olympian in my book. Someone who goes to the Olympics but doesn’t take part is a……spectator.

            In true 12 year old style I looked for a definition of an Olympian and a couple used the phrase “competitor in….” which rules her out. So unless Ashleigh unexpectedly hails from the Mt Olympus region of Greece we can’t refer to her as an Olympian.

          • SprintRelayFan
            SprintRelayFan commented
            Editing a comment
            Yes I agree that you're not an olympian unless you've competed in. I think even FS'ing counts...but she's unlucky in a way to have been selected for 4 olympics and not having competed! Perhaps S-C is right and she'll make a triumphant debut in Paris

        • #23
          UKA strategic operational plan is online if anyone's interested: UKA-Operational-Plan-2021-2032.pdf

          Comment


          • Stew-Coach
            Stew-Coach commented
            Editing a comment
            printed and will read

        • #24
          Originally posted by Occasional Hope View Post
          UKA strategic operational plan is online if anyone's interested: UKA-Operational-Plan-2021-2032.pdf
          Wow a management operational plan !!. I can hardly wait not to read it after listening to Coates babbling management speak in interview recently.

          Comment


          • #25
            I was watching 2017 again, and despite his wonder run, the commentator did comment that right at the end NMB got tight - I wonder whether the answer is move him onto 2 or 3 and change Prescod's funding to relay only and have him on 4?

            Comment


            • JamieSLA
              JamieSLA commented
              Editing a comment
              For me I think it's just about proving his speed now. If he's running under 20.2 and 10.1 respectively, we can usually trust him on anchor. If not, we have enough talent in my opinion to drop him.

              CJ - Hughes - Gemili - Prescod if all fit is our most ideal line up going forward I think. OJ is a handy relay runner who i'd like to see return when he's back to form. I can see someone like Azu adding some variance to the first leg. A position I still think Andrew Robertson had missed opportunities to occupy.

          • #26
            Back to Ashleigh Nelson. She says she competed in Rio: https://thesportsedit.com/blogs/news...elled-now-what

            So she is an Olympian after all.

            Comment


            • SprintRelayFan
              SprintRelayFan commented
              Editing a comment
              Wikipedia disagrees with her saying it was Asha-Dina-Desiree-Daryl in both the heat and final...I also checked the 100 and 200 individuals.

            • LoveSprints1
              LoveSprints1 commented
              Editing a comment
              That is a real shame to have spanned four and been selected for three Olympics and not to have been given the chance to compete. There was surprise at her inclusion this year ahead of Desiree Henry, but it must be gutting to be in that position.

          • #27
            Just thinking if it is announced on 18/10 what do they do about CJ as presumably his appeal won't have gone through by then?

            Comment


            • Stew-Coach
              Stew-Coach commented
              Editing a comment
              Does say cant be involved in any issues at time of decision. So would say on that most likely rules him out.

              Interesting all the relays are limited to 6 members, I think any decisions on the men's side will be tough

            • SprintRelayFan
              SprintRelayFan commented
              Editing a comment
              Ah ok thanks.
              Yes, tricky to find a 6 although made easier by cj being out. Zharnel you’d assume will get podium and perhaps they’ll keep gemili on it

            • SprintRelayFan
              SprintRelayFan commented
              Editing a comment
              Ha. Just checked the lists.
              There were only 5 men funded for sprint relay but seven women

          • #28
            https://www.britishathletics.org.uk/...programme-wcp/

            Comment


            • #29
              Reece Prescod down to relay funding.

              Comment


              • #30
                It's a shame that Hannah Williams did not get onto relay funding or that big sis Jodie wasn't moved up to podium or podium potential.

                Assume (rightly) that with Lynsey Sharpe, she has to remain on the same tier during maternity?

                Olympic Confirmation Level is an interesting new twist.

                The British Athletics Olympic World Class Programme Athletes:

                Olympic Podium (17):

                Dina Asher-Smith

                Alex Bell

                Holly Bradshaw

                Adam Gemili

                Callum Hawkins

                Keely Hodgkinson

                Abigail Irozuru

                Katarina Johnson-Thompson

                Josh Kerr

                Nick Miller

                Laura Muir

                Andrew Pozzi

                Jemma Reekie

                Jazmin Sawyers

                Lynsey Sharp

                Lorraine Ugen

                Jake Wightman



                Olympic Podium Potential (26):

                Elizabeth Bird

                Emily Borthwick

                Taylor Campbell

                Harry Coppell

                Melissa Courtney-Bryant

                Oliver Dustin

                Niamh Emerson

                Tom Gale

                Elliot Giles

                Jake Heyward

                Jessie Knight

                Morgan Lake

                Scott Lincoln

                Eilish McColgan

                Sophie McKinna

                Naomi Metzger (née Ogbeta)

                Lawrence Okoye

                Aimee Pratt

                Charlotte Purdue

                Daniel Rowden

                Marc Scott

                Cindy Sember

                Jessica Turner

                Jamie Webb

                Laura Weightman

                Callum Wilkinson



                Olympic Relays (16):

                Kristal Awuah

                Zoey Clark

                Emily Diamond

                Beth Dobbin

                Zharnel Hughes

                Richard Kilty

                Imani-Lara Lansiquot

                Nethaneel Mitchell-Blake

                Daryll Neita

                Ashleigh Nelson

                Laviai Nielsen

                Asha Philip

                Ama Pipi

                Reece Prescod

                Jodie Williams

                Nicole Yeargin



                Olympic Confirmation Level (8):

                Jeremiah Azu

                Ellie Baker

                Molly Caudery

                Piers Copeland

                Jona Efoloko

                Jessica Mayho

                Holly Mills

                Thomas Randolph


                Last edited by LoveSprints1; 18-10-21, 16:05.

                Comment


                • trickstat
                  trickstat commented
                  Editing a comment
                  You are correct about Lynsey Sharpe. On the other hand, her partner, Andy Butchart, has lost his funding.
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