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Linford Christie furiously accuses the Met of institutional racism

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  • Ursus
    replied
    She is the public face of the Met and the rank and file would expect her to have their backs. But in the current climate she’d be nuts to try to defend the indefensible.

    Re changing rules, I think there was something along those lines earlier in the case about the use of handcuffs.

    Only those who have seen all the evidence like Dick, unlike us, can make a judgement on what really happened. Not sure about counter arguing in the court of public opinion - are the police restricted from sharing anything which may subsequently be used as evidence in court / disciplinary proceedings? Would also be curious to know if the athletes tried to resolve this through official channels before taking to Twitter.

    Leave a comment:


  • jjimbojames
    replied
    Precisely what I would expect from someone in her position - she is the public face of the Met. One outcome may be that the report says the officers followed the rules but that the rules are in need of reform, but the additional footage will be key, I think. Sharing that would help the court of public opinion

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  • Ursus
    replied
    https://www.lbc.co.uk/news/dame-cres...lliams-racism/

    So, while having apologised for distress and having referred the matter to the Independent Office for Police Conduct, the Met Commissioner says she personally can’t see any evidence of racism, that any officer worth their salt would have stopped a car driving in that manner and that the Met’s own professional standards people couldn’t see any misconduct either. Also makes the point that she’s seen a lot of footage not in the public domain.

    Pretty clear what she thinks. She’d be reckless to say all that if she wasn’t sure of her ground.
    Last edited by Ursus; 22-07-20, 13:07.

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  • Laps
    commented on 's reply
    You assume the worst motives from minimal evidence, somewhat pathetic evidence actually.

    I am not lecturing anyone. Just pointing out that if you react like she did you are likely to end up in handcuffs and not be in a position to look after your young child.

    My comment about Cressida Dick was not negative in the slightest. She did what she had to do quickly and without prejudicing whatever conclusions are eventually reached. She has to react in that way these days in her position.

  • Sovietvest
    commented on 's reply
    You write that you are treating with contempt my "assumption that the police always act dishonestly in such situations". However, I have only commented on this specific case and nowhere do i suggest it is typical of the Met - I have no view on whether this is typical behaviour.

    Ironic that someone lecturing a young woman on her lack of self control introduces emotive words like contempt into a MB discussion.

    I also enjoy the condescending way you imply that I have made up my mind with insufficient evidence whilst you remain so open minded and balanced in your views. Really? You have formed some very firm - and negative - opinions about the behaviour and motives of Bianca and indeed Cressida Dick..

  • drobbie
    replied
    Originally posted by jjimbojames View Post
    I don’t think anyone on here is suggesting anything, merely that there are currently two sides until more comes out, and that we’d like to see all footage. I don’t know any of the people involved personally, so just to jump in and make assumptions without digging deeper would not seem my best course of action. Completely understand that for some on this board, as with any example, they will have reason to be more pro one side without needing more; I’ve defended other athletes over the years because I’ve been in a position to not wait for more info to become public, too.
    as far as i can tell, the two athletes didnt do anything wrong and they way the police acted during the stop was reasonable polite and efficient, the issue for me is why they were stopped in the first place and the initial police statement which was full of misrepresentations - tinited windows were standard merc windows, wrong side of the road - there only was a one lane middle part of the road they could have driven down, male driver refused to get out - he questioned why he was stopped and got out after 10 seconds

    Leave a comment:


  • Laps
    commented on 's reply
    Well if I was investigating I would want all the video including car and bodycam footage and to piece it together as far as possible in time and context. I take it from what has been said by the police that there is plenty of unseen material which will go to the independent Office for Police Conduct . It is ridiculous to suggest that it should just be dumped into the public domain for people to misuse, mislead and stir up trouble as they do.

    The key point, in the context of police conduct, is what caused them to regard the car and its occupants as possibly behaving suspiciously i.e. what caused them to give chase. Particularly did the car speed off and did the driver ignore or seem to ignore an initial order to stop? Neither you nor I have a clue as to what extent, if any, this is true. The rest, all your stuff, is of secondary importance. Heavy handed perhaps, but BW's reaction gave them good reason for being insistent. C. Dick's apology is political to take some of the heat off. Who knows what she really thinks. People in her sort of position are apt to apologise first and then find out or events tend to overtake them.

    As for Bianca Williams my opinion hasn't changed. We will have to agree to differ. She seems very keen to take on the police using provocative language. On your assumption that the police always act dishonestly in such situations, so must be doing so here, I would treat that with the contempt it deserves.

    Whilst you clearly have made up your mind, I will keep an open mind until the key point is clear.

  • jjimbojames
    replied
    I don’t think anyone on here is suggesting anything, merely that there are currently two sides until more comes out, and that we’d like to see all footage. I don’t know any of the people involved personally, so just to jump in and make assumptions without digging deeper would not seem my best course of action. Completely understand that for some on this board, as with any example, they will have reason to be more pro one side without needing more; I’ve defended other athletes over the years because I’ve been in a position to not wait for more info to become public, too.

    Leave a comment:


  • Sovietvest
    replied
    Originally posted by jjimbojames View Post
    Note the Met apologised for distress caused, not the actual incident - might seem like semantics, but that’s a very deliberate choice of words....more “I’m sorry you felt upset” than “I’m sorry our actions were unjust and made you upset”. I don’t think she thinks they did anything wrong, but was doing the media-savvy bit.

    It’s getting ugly - A longer version of the video is now doing the social media rounds (there’s a link to it on a reply under Bianca’s Twitter post), with someone (not Bianca) having added words to give a different narrative - suggesting it was a set up to catch the police out. Bianca has been on radio saying they chose not to stop and drove round the corner to their house instead, which is seen in the longer video, with her side being they wanted somewhere safer and the other being Ricardo deliberately drove off from the police. Comments on the video (again, editing by someone else, but her footage) suggest she seems to go from calm to hysterical very quickly. People calling for her to be removed from TeamGB, if she’s lying, whilst others commenting that the point is this is wholly unlikely to have happened to a white couple.

    I wonder if, after the complaint has been investigated, we will get to see the police bodycam footage, as full transparency would be good for settling the various rumours. I think this will rumble on a bit longer...
    People should not be given the impression that this version of the video presents additional information that undermine Bianca's case or in any way presents a valid alternative narrative. The video starts with the caption "The truth about what really happened.. .. " It then goes on to speculate that it was an elaborate set up and Bianca produced a performance worth of an Oscar. So this was produced by a person who defines the "truth" as whatever he or she conjures up from their own fevered imagination.

    Yes, it's a slightly longer version. What the additional footage shows is that the time between a policeman appearing next to Ricardo's car door and Ricardo actually getting out of the car was less than 14 seconds. Not at any point does he refuse to get out of the car, he simply asks "for what?"

    People are referring to Bianca's originally posted video as an 'edited version'. This creates the impression she cut it to create a false impression. That is clearly not the case when the longer version undermines the Police claim that Ricardo refused to leave the car.

    The Police have demonstrated that they will bring any evidence and use any means to justify what they did, whilst implying fault on the part of Ricardo / Bianca. If there was anything else they could throw into the mix - especially any footage from bodycams - they would have already done so. For people to continue to adopt the view that "the truth" still needs to come out, and that there are rumours and theories circulating that we need to keep an open mind over is nonsense. It's the classic "No smoke without fire", "They were probably guilty of something else" attitude that is used to undermine victims and results in people turning a blind eye to discrimination.

    Leave a comment:


  • Occasional Hope
    replied
    IPOC is investigating the incident, so more info may well emerge.

    "Bianca has been on radio saying they chose not to stop and drove round the corner to their house instead"

    Well, that was a bit silly imo.

    Leave a comment:


  • jjimbojames
    commented on 's reply
    I agree - all footage available from both sides means people can put the whole picture together.

  • Johannes Factotum
    replied
    If the Met wants to clear this up, release the body cam footage.

    Leave a comment:


  • jjimbojames
    replied
    Note the Met apologised for distress caused, not the actual incident - might seem like semantics, but that’s a very deliberate choice of words....more “I’m sorry you felt upset” than “I’m sorry our actions were unjust and made you upset”. I don’t think she thinks they did anything wrong, but was doing the media-savvy bit.

    It’s getting ugly - A longer version of the video is now doing the social media rounds (there’s a link to it on a reply under Bianca’s Twitter post), with someone (not Bianca) having added words to give a different narrative - suggesting it was a set up to catch the police out. Bianca has been on radio saying they chose not to stop and drove round the corner to their house instead, which is seen in the longer video, with her side being they wanted somewhere safer and the other being Ricardo deliberately drove off from the police. Comments on the video (again, editing by someone else, but her footage) suggest she seems to go from calm to hysterical very quickly. People calling for her to be removed from TeamGB, if she’s lying, whilst others commenting that the point is this is wholly unlikely to have happened to a white couple.

    I wonder if, after the complaint has been investigated, we will get to see the police bodycam footage, as full transparency would be good for settling the various rumours. I think this will rumble on a bit longer...

    Leave a comment:


  • Sovietvest
    commented on 's reply
    So, you consider Bianca an idiot for reacting the way she did. I think the vast majority of young mothers with a three month old baby would have reacted in the same way under the same circumstances.

    You suggest we should "wait until the facts are clear"? What additional facts were you expecting to come out of this? The Police provided a writtent statement to Bianca and Ricardo and then followed it up wit ha further statement to the press. There are no more 'facts' they can conjure up. Regardless, nothing the Police have presented provides grounds for either stopping Bianca and Ricardo or handcuffing them.

    I don't consider my comments a knee-jerk reaction, or emotional and I've never taken part in a media pile on in my life. It's patronising to assume that because someone feels strongly about something they consider an injustice, they are driven by emotion.

    Luckily someone has "reflected on what was said and done in the heat of the moment" and concluded that Bianca and Ricardo are due an apology - thank you Cressida Dick.

  • Laps
    commented on 's reply
    If you don't stay calm and do as you are told by the police you are an idiot. What good comes of doing the opposite?

    I'll wait until the facts are clear and people have reflected on what was said and done in the heat of the moment. Boring I know. More fun to join in the media pile-on.
    It's all kneejerk, emotion and taking sides these days.
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