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World 400m champion Naser provisionally suspended by AIU

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  • #16
    I think you have to draw the line somewhere, otherwise who is the WR holder - Sanya RR? Do we exclude Allyson Felix for her coach’s past athletes and their history?

    I think SMU and Perec have very similar ranges and styles, but SMU’s superior basic speed may well see her surpass Perec by the end of her career. I think the Doha conditions that day were ideal and probably flatter a little, but someone with her speed, her height and working on her endurance has to be the best chance we have of running super quick times legally. People could question her coach, but no one seems to when talking about MHS!

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Sovietvest View Post

      I sympathise with your view on Koch as WR holder - given the records uncovered in the 90s, there is no doubt she doped. However, if her name is removed, Kratochvilova - for whom there is no concrete evidence of doping - would be the new WR holder. So we'd replace a doper with a slightly less fast doper.

      As for Perec - why should we have any confidence that she was clean? She was coached by John Smith! I could spend the next hour sharing his associations with proven drug takers. This is the guy that Ben Johnson's coach, Charlie Francis, credited with teaching him everything he knew about steroids.
      Well, the issue with DDR doping was that the proof that it happened was definitively established in a Court of Law (that is, not a Sporting Court, but a Criminal Court), by publications in scientific journals etc, so the standard of proof is as high as it possibly can be. So it's established to a much higher than the standard that IAAF routinely applies to erase your everyday dopers' times, for example.

      Because this standard is so high, the DDR records can safely be erased without risking a domino effect of a mass purge of all those other records where only rumour, supposition and innuendo are offered as evidence.
      Last edited by Grassmarket; 10-06-20, 09:14.

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      • #18
        Oh, 'ello Grassmarket!

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Grassmarket View Post

          Well, the issue with DDR doping was that the proof that it happened was definitively established in a Court of Law (that is, not a Sporting Court, but a Criminal Court), by publications in scientific journals etc, so the standard of proof is as high as it possibly can be. So it's established to a much higher than the standard that IAAF routinely applies to erase your everyday dopers' times, for example.

          Because this standard is so high, the DDR records can safely be erased without risking a domino effect of a mass purge of all those other records where only rumour, supposition and innuendo are offered as evidence.
          Fully agree, Grassmarket - there is more than enough evidence of GDR doping (I red the book by the husband and wife team that uncovered the documents detailing the doses given to each athlete). My point was just that if you take Koch off the all-time list we'll have "WR - 47.99 Jarmila Kratochvilova" on our screens every time we watch a 400. So we replace a doper with a slightly slower doper.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by jjimbojames View Post
            I think you have to draw the line somewhere, otherwise who is the WR holder - Sanya RR? Do we exclude Allyson Felix for her coach’s past athletes and their history?

            I think SMU and Perec have very similar ranges and styles, but SMU’s superior basic speed may well see her surpass Perec by the end of her career. I think the Doha conditions that day were ideal and probably flatter a little, but someone with her speed, her height and working on her endurance has to be the best chance we have of running super quick times legally. People could question her coach, but no one seems to when talking about MHS!
            I know, I know, it's hard to find a coach in the US not tainted by past doping busts. When people mention Braumann they focus on his prison time for fraud but the association with Mullins and Gay is more worrying.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by LuckySpikes View Post
              Oh, 'ello Grassmarket!
              Thank you. Exiled, I’m afraid. 🤬

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